Not Dead Yet - Forum

In our town we have an Adult Resources centre where people with learning disabilities go to learn to have some Independence. They opened Noah's Cafe last year where they make cakes buns pies etc and sell them to offices and anyone who phones. Today, in our local paper it is reported that it will most probably close and why? Lack of funding!!! So Lesley ash gets £ 5,000,00 compensation and peter hain resigns over non disclosure of £ 100,000. and thats ok, but the disabled, forget it they have to go cap in hand to get anything.

Betty, This is where My sence of humour, makes Me Laugh??
WHY??? because of the complete Waste of Money!!  Going to the wrong people/projects??-- It would otherwise make me breakdown and Cry!!-- The Worse a person is, The More they receive??? --Peter Hain will possibly come back, into a much Higher paid position?? -- They sure seem to??

I read today 2 MPs husband and wife who live not far from me,have been claiming rent on a flat in London they sold to a family trust ( the trust being themselves and 1 offspring)to the tune of £165,826.They insisted they had done nothing wrong !!!!!and the bizarre arrangement was cleared with authorities, but passing it over to a trust meant they could claim the full market rent on the flat believed to be around £2,500 a month-dispite the fact they are two of the three trustees.
Food for thought ! >:(

theres no depth to what these people will sink, one consolation, there aint no pockets in shrouds.

True William,but they aint dead yet !!

As I have said before!!  

"LOVELLY COUNTRY, SHAME ABOUT THE PEOPLE IN SO CALLED RESPONCIBLE POSITIONS" ?????????????????????????????????

Phoenix, don't forget, they try their best - but perhaps it's question of "the right man not being on the right place" as we say. Look at the administration - at least in Germany - today someone is in charge of transporation and the next day he is in charge of education for instance. If this person doesn't have a really qualified staff, he is lost.

Hum!! So many not 'trained' or qualified people?? Not accepting responcibility of their position or even in training their staff?? = no relevant skills or expertise that 'warrants' their jobs. No common sence or logic to 'assist' them, in a job worth doing  -- for their people's benifit?? -- I would still expect that in Germany, everything would be more under Control!! --- or if you like -- More Precise!!

our young generation approaches "European standards", i.e. feeling responsible for one's decision or for the welfare of the staff or the firm slackens. My generation considered working in a firm as being responsible for the firm, as otherweise our own job and that of others would be endangered. But - perhaps due to globalisation - this changed and at present we have a lot of "scandals".

What is 'european standards' ?? Responcibility for one's Actions and Decisions?? Ah!! This is just what we had in the 50/60s. An obligation to the company, that one worked for/with!! -- All was quite simple really, as we where taught to do a job -- well done. Which we did!! --- Just why anything should 'alter' from those standards, I don't know ??-- As for "GLOBALISATION" ??  What is the point??

"UNITED WE STAND, DIVIDED WE FALL" -- Nothing but Nothing, should be left to The Few!! -- i.e. All Countries or None??

Phoenix, what you write may be right from your point of view - however, I remember in the 60/70s there was a great difference between the moral of German, French and British workers. Today its everywhere the same. On the contrary, sometimes I have the impression that French or British workers have even more discipline than German ones. Somehow we have become a "Wohlstandsgesellschaft" (welfare society?).

Teri,  Having such a wide experiance of the 60s. in Britain and Germany, the working 'standards' were high as was Disapline!! -- Today??  It seems to have become a 'shambles' and as you state, a welfare society. We now have 6 million non workers and that is a really 'terrible' shame. -- Is It just as bad in european countries ??

The number of people without work is not the same in all European countries. Even in the Länder of Germany it's varying - for instance in the Land, in which I live the rate of unemployed is rather low, whereas in the new Länder in the eastern part of Germany there are a lot of people without work, above all young people.

Am pleased to know Not all countries are having the same problems ?? -- I do however,'fear' for the younger generation, as to what Future, there may be for them ??

I read today
Voters are fed up with migrant chaos (so says Browns very own pollster)
Have the woke up at last !  ::) ::) ::)

Phoenix, that's true the younger generation will perhaps have more problems as there is less and less work for so-called non-qualified persons - on the other side there are less and less children born in Germany and if we can believe our politicians more and more efforts will be made to improve our system of education.
In Germany we say "the soup is not eaten as hot as it's cooked".

They have woke up Mac, but what r they going to do about it,send em back, I dont think so.the do-gooders wud have apoplexy.

Teri, Generalising In this country. The 'up and coming' youngsters, that want a family and Home, will undoubtedly, find their chances more and more difficult, as Time moves on. Life will become increasingly harder, in the next few years, as it will for us all?? -- Can anyone, anywhere, actually believe their politicians and their promices??
Sure enough the education standards are ever changing here, but the 'End Product' does not mean much, so they 'play' some more??

 "DOES THE END, JUSTIFY THE MEANS" ???

Granting 2 days remission to escaped prisoners marks a new low in penal policy,criminals used to learn an inportant lesson in prison:if you cant do the time,dont do the crime.Now the only one they learn is that crime pays-even after they have been sent down !

For all you who reject the EU - in our today's news they said that the EU is just going to fix single regulations for sending illegal immigrants back home - isn't that a "light at the end of the tunnel"? However, our "Greens" find that these regulations are far too severe!

OH!!  Hurray!!   We are now being allowed ---  Curved Cucumber's back again??  So very good of the eu. just to have a 'meeting' to let us all know ????????

Phoenix, why are you so pessimistic - small steps are better than none!

I dont think its pessimism Teri,our cucumbers etc were fine they way they were,and all the silly money cost to make a straight one is just daft ! these are the nonsence rules we dont need.I read recently that there are only the brits doing this,most ignore the rules anyway.
Whats your bet the greens will win !!
Let us hope they all  learn from this free for all Eu state,and put a cap on it we still have Turkey to join next.

Mac, no I don't think the Green will win as Germans are sometimes narrow-minded regarding "foreigners" (immigrants). Nevertheless they love to spend their holidays in foreign countries, Turkey for example. There was a time they were called "the word champions in travelling" - but with the present high costs of fuel they discover in what a beautiful country they are living.

Yes Teri,we have a beautiful country too,but it is much to expensive to holiday here,and of course we are not guaranteed the weather ! so when we go on holiday here we have to pack for the 4 seasons ! lol

There is Nothing wrong, with any Country!!
Only with the people that live in those countries!!
Pessimistic??  Not a chance!! -- Practical Person, is THE Answer!! -- As for 'small steps'?? Is that a Joke??
 What do you think got us in this 'Mess' in the first place
STEALTH!! By the so called Buero'rats, while the so called people were sleeping ::) ::) The 'crisis' in this country, did not happen overnight!! -- Blinkered people cannot be helped, untill they wake up and realise just what is actually happening ::) ::) ::)

Phoenix I cannot judge the situation in your country, but when I was in Scotland last year, people didn't really look too unhappy there. However, when I will be in Wales on my holidays, I'll watch them more closely and inform you of my opinion.

One hardly gets a true picture, when on holiday, in another country?? Wherever that may be!!There yet again. Scotland is Independant -- As long as England Pay's!!
Just like The NHS. far better Service, if you are a scot??

Well,seemingly the Scots have a lot to smile about !!!

Scots Smile!!  Must Do??  our friend that has Terminal Cancer, should be on Drugs -- But The power's to be say NO??  If She lived in Scotland, She woulf Receive That Benifit ---- NOW!! -- Along with very many othere's of course!!

That's really strange that you have two different health systems in one country. In Germany it depends much on the doctor if you get the pills or not. He has a budget and if it's alrady exhausted, you don't get them!

Do you pay into a system like us Teri too ?
Do you have an NHS ?

Strange ?? There is nothing so strange as The System, in this country!! Our Friend, with Terminal cancer, had been promised The Drugs to contain the Cancer, in Her Lungs and Kidney's -- PROMISED I SAID!! Now these have been Denied her, All I suppose because of COST!! -- The Trauma, She has been put through, is extremely difficult to even imagine. She has been told they will need more scans in 2/3 months?? being on Morphine, which is only for the terrific Pain, she is in. Are the Power's to be, just waiting for her To DIE ???  Many other cancer paitients, are in similar situations. One Man committed suicide yesterday!! Drugs were Denied and he could not Pay for them privately!! ------
Does anyone really understand, just WHY we are so very Bloody ANGRY ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???

I think we don't have a NHS, but we have different health insurances, legal and private one, i.e. if you are employed in a firm and earning not so much money, you will share either the legal health insurance AOK or a so-called substitute health insurance DAK, Barmer etc. etc. and if you are self-employed or earning a lot of money you will join a private health insurance. The difference is that the private health insurance is more expensive but you get better treatment when you are ill. I, for instance, have joined a substitute health insurance and for hospital traatment I have an additional private health insurance.

Phoenix in Germany in case of cancer all is done to ease the pain independent of the costs involved. However, I ask myself sometimes why we do not more to either avoid or discover cancer earlier.

Teri, We do have many private health insurance companies here. But!! They are not only Expencive, but also have 'clauses' written in, to actually Save them paying Out!! -- Not forgetting ?? AGE, Is Limited!! TOO!!
As some Cancer Drugs are 'available' in Scotland ?? Why Not In England as well?? Anything to save Life or to extend, The Quality of The patients remaining Life ????
NHS versus Cancer!!  Is not The Doctor's OATH to preserve Life, in the Best way possible?? -- How many Cancer Patients are 'hoping' for life giving Drugs ??? ---
 Many can be helped, if Money was NOT Wasted????????????

This is becoming the norm here too Teri
if you want better care you have to pay,but not so long ago it was everyones right to good care.
This is what I mean by too many people , we just cant cater !
I have just paid to see a specialist to be told I have cancer when the NHS should have told me,so why didnt they ?
they are so tied up with so many patients they cant cope !
you see when we opened the flood gates we didnt cater for the worlds ailments its not just Europe that come to be treated sick people know if they are ill all they have to do is get to the UK by whatever means,and us here being politically correct have to treat them at whatever cost to the founders of the system,its a lot to take in but it is the truth.I have just paid £150 to see a consultant and am facing a £7000.00 bill for the op,because the NHS waiting list is too long,time I dont have,so I will mortgage my house and have it done,with the help of my boys,but I feel cheated to say the least.

Hello Mac,  My Heart, Bleeds for You!!
The NHS. is almost at it's Lowest Ebb, due to so many people from abroad, taking an unfair advantage!!
 I note you have paid £150 to see a Consultant, for the diagnosis, when The NHS. should have done that for you.
Will The operation be successful for You ??
Would You have to be on any Drugs?? Will NHS Provide You ??
Our Close friend, was actually told that Drugs would be given Her. At the next visit this week -- She has been told, that She cannot now have them? (cost yet again) ???
 There has been so many 'tears' and She will Visuit us, saturday pm. --- More Stress to come??
We believe that Every cancer patient is being 'Cheated' because of the 'influx' from abroad!! Our Services cannot cope with them all??-- Eve and I, Feel for You:

Mac, I'm not acquainted with your NHS - but when I feel something is wrong with me, I ask my doctor to give me a "Überweisung" (a paper allowing me to go to a specialist). Our normal doctors only can deal with "normal illnesses" and it would be asked too much of them to deal with "women illnesses" for instance. However, on the other side many diseases are just discovered,too late. The husband of one of my best friends is in hospital because of cancer at the moment. He always had a headache and he visited specialists, but even they found out - a bit too late - that he has a tumor between the hear and the lungs.

As with many'things'here,it is either, Time or Money?? Normally, it is Both!! -- With NHS. If all Doctor's (General Practioner's) forwarded Patients for specialist Checks, earlier enough, some lives may be saved or the correct Drugs could be given, as soon as possible:

here is one example how money can be saved by the NHS, Mac will agree with me im sure. Apatient breaks a leg goes to hosp, a plaster is applied,home he goes.within the next day or two he taken by ambulance back to hosp to check the plaster cast is ok.WHY, the district nurse, the doctor, or anyone with nursing training can check that its ok. That is how it used to be.Multiply this thousands of times over the country, and thousands of pounds would be saved. Its not rocket science. That is one example. I go to the eye clince 6 mthly. sat in the general waiting, I wonder, how many need to be here, how many could be seen by their gp or district nurse.

I think this is a bit different in Germany. After an operation you go after two, four or six weeks (depending on the operation) back to hospital for checking. In the meantime you consult your "Hausarzt" (house doctor?). Only very severe cases have to go to hospital regularly for checking. After my eye operation I went once again to hospital after 6 weeks and now I have to go regularly to the eye doctor for checking and if he's of the opinion that there's something wrong, he will send me to hospital for checking.

Reading all this I say thank God for the NHS
happy 60th birthday
and long may it reign.!

Yes I do agree William,but we are getting there now we are having clinics at the GPs to do this work and the district nurses are doing it too,back to basics then for them lol why didnt they ask us ? lol


Teri here when one is plastered (I dont mean drunk lol)
it is always checked 24 hours later to make sure the plaster is not too tight.As for the eye doctor we have that as standard here we have tests every year and they spot the abnormalities,and its free for most but not all.But all children are free as are diabetics.

Heres a bit of news I am going into the first hospital to be opened by the NHS its called Trafford general ! Thank you Mr Bevan you may have saved my life !

Phoenix what we got is far superior to a lot of other countries,I agree it could be better,but its better than nowt and again I say thank you to Mr Bevan (wish I could say the same about Mr Brown) glad you are feeling better and taken the dog for a walk ! keep smiling.

Hello Mac,Have been wondering how You are, even though I am not on forum so much. As we all get Older, we naturally expect that our 'used bodies' will require some assistance from the NHS. hoping our needs are small. -----
 Yes!! Our NHS. used to be The Envy, of The World??
 Currently, there has been Immence progress in the recent years, which has certainly helped millions. ---
 The 'Downfall' of The NHS. has been to allow the cleaning standards to Fall -- partly due to costs, as Cleaning is a 'cut throat' business and normally the 'cheapest' company gets the contract!! --- "What Price Cleanliness" ::) ::) ::) -- Have Good Experiance there!! 

Hi Phoenix
I am doing ok,but the waiting is getting me down,no date as yet,I will let you know when i hear.    :-*

Mac, Am very happy to know that You are OK!!

Playing The Waiting game, is so much more depressing and playes on The Nerves??   There are Four of US, waiting for Hospital Appoinments, to come in.  Five with yourself!!

Our 'minds' are playing us ----Hell!!

Ty Phoenix
I have my date now so I work towards it.
Its no easier mind you,but the waiting has to be worse .
Hope you all get yours soon.

"IF ONLT THINGS WOULD GET BETTER, REMEMBER HOW LIFE USED TO BE"    ?????

THIS WAS THE FIRST LINE OF MY POEM THAT I HAD PUBLISHED AND HAVE ALSO PLACED IN THIS FORUM!!  -- AH!!  IF ONLY ??

HAPPY THAT YOU HAVE YOUR APPOINTMENT THROUGH!!
HOPING THAT ALL GOES WELL!!

Thank you Phoenix,I will keep you all informed.